Through a Glass, Darkly Comments http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com Collecting my thoughts on what it means to be the church, among other things. Fri, 20 Nov 2009 16:30:34 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=1.5.1-alpha by: Tyler Watson http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/03/09/too-many-directions-at-once/#comment-97 Tue, 20 Mar 2007 13:47:58 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/03/09/too-many-directions-at-once/#comment-97 Brittany, your last comment is dead-on. In my experience, putting ongoing or old ministries to rest is extremely difficult in congregations. Those who participate in the ministries may draw much of their identity from them. There are numerous stories of pastors losing their jobs because they ended or altered certain ministries. That's not to say your point isn't correct -- I think it is refreshingly so -- but that it is difficult to stop something a church has done for a while. As for the topic of the post, I would agree that it's generally better to focus on a few things than several things. I'm sure there's a crude analogy between churches who focus vs. churches who don't and In-N-Out vs. McDonald's here. This goes to a question of discernment. We all come together with different interests and concerns. If I agree that God is calling my church to work for affordable housing (to use your example), but my concern is with addressing nuclear nonproliferation, then I might be called to sideline (partially or in toto) my personal passion in order to work with the whole. It's difficult difficult but good work to convince people of this. Brittany, your last comment is dead-on. In my experience, putting ongoing or old ministries to rest is extremely difficult in congregations. Those who participate in the ministries may draw much of their identity from them. There are numerous stories of pastors losing their jobs because they ended or altered certain ministries. That’s not to say your point isn’t correct — I think it is refreshingly so — but that it is difficult to stop something a church has done for a while.

As for the topic of the post, I would agree that it’s generally better to focus on a few things than several things. I’m sure there’s a crude analogy between churches who focus vs. churches who don’t and In-N-Out vs. McDonald’s here. This goes to a question of discernment. We all come together with different interests and concerns. If I agree that God is calling my church to work for affordable housing (to use your example), but my concern is with addressing nuclear nonproliferation, then I might be called to sideline (partially or in toto) my personal passion in order to work with the whole. It’s difficult difficult but good work to convince people of this.

]]> by: Brittany http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/03/09/too-many-directions-at-once/#comment-96 Sat, 17 Mar 2007 18:58:50 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/03/09/too-many-directions-at-once/#comment-96 I guess part of focusing is saying no to new things that don't fit our vision, and also saying no to old ministries that seem to be fading in spirit and effectiveness. I guess part of focusing is saying no to new things that don’t fit our vision, and also saying no to old ministries that seem to be fading in spirit and effectiveness.

]]> by: James http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/03/09/too-many-directions-at-once/#comment-95 Fri, 16 Mar 2007 12:11:00 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/03/09/too-many-directions-at-once/#comment-95 Mums and Buds seems exactly like the kind of thing we should encourage. From what I know of it, it seems like there is a lot of life there, and the people involved are excited about it and committed to it. I think I am more discouraged by the kinds of projects that we have to actively recruit for and persuade people to fill roles that they may not really be excited about or gifted for. I'm not sure what the best method for narrowing our focus could be, but I don't think discouarging people's visions and dreams for ministry is something we want to do. Mums and Buds seems exactly like the kind of thing we should encourage. From what I know of it, it seems like there is a lot of life there, and the people involved are excited about it and committed to it. I think I am more discouraged by the kinds of projects that we have to actively recruit for and persuade people to fill roles that they may not really be excited about or gifted for. I’m not sure what the best method for narrowing our focus could be, but I don’t think discouarging people’s visions and dreams for ministry is something we want to do.

]]> by: Brittany http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/03/09/too-many-directions-at-once/#comment-94 Tue, 13 Mar 2007 19:45:48 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/03/09/too-many-directions-at-once/#comment-94 Hi James. I think this is an interesting topic. I want to hear more about how you think this might work. I have questions. I'm thinking about Mums and Buds and if when I first proposed it what it would have been like for me to hear something like this: "We care about mothers and young families but as a church we don't feel called to that particular ministry. Will you instead spend the energy you would have spent on Mums and Buds on (fill in the blank)?" I think I would have been able to accept that decision. I respect leadership with a clear, Spirit-led vision. Mums and Buds is a specific ministry designed to serve a limited group of women. Perhaps it is too narrow? What are your thoughts? Hi James. I think this is an interesting topic. I want to hear more about how you think this might work. I have questions. I’m thinking about Mums and Buds and if when I first proposed it what it would have been like for me to hear something like this: “We care about mothers and young families but as a church we don’t feel called to that particular ministry. Will you instead spend the energy you would have spent on Mums and Buds on (fill in the blank)?” I think I would have been able to accept that decision. I respect leadership with a clear, Spirit-led vision. Mums and Buds is a specific ministry designed to serve a limited group of women. Perhaps it is too narrow? What are your thoughts?

]]> by: Eric http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/26/little-moments-of-grace/#comment-93 Fri, 02 Mar 2007 22:06:11 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/26/little-moments-of-grace/#comment-93 Wow...now that I look back on it too, we avoided a lot of disasters on that trip. Praise God for not letting anything serious happen. Wow…now that I look back on it too, we avoided a lot of disasters on that trip. Praise God for not letting anything serious happen.

]]> by: James http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/26/little-moments-of-grace/#comment-92 Wed, 28 Feb 2007 08:32:14 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/26/little-moments-of-grace/#comment-92 At least we didn't have 30 kids projectile vomiting at the same time! At least we didn’t have 30 kids projectile vomiting at the same time!

]]> by: Luke http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/26/little-moments-of-grace/#comment-91 Tue, 27 Feb 2007 10:58:22 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/26/little-moments-of-grace/#comment-91 I can remember several times in youth ministry where sure disasters were avoided. Looking back I can honestly say that the only way we got through those trips, was because of God's protection and guidance. I always find it cool how God can even use a group of "stoner kids" (a group that most of society would deem as unworthy of much of anything) to help him out. I also find it interesting how God chooses to show us how He is in charge of what's going on. Glad you had a good trip. As I read, I also realized again how I'm glad I'm not in youth ministry any more, although trips were always a highlight. I can remember several times in youth ministry where sure disasters were avoided. Looking back I can honestly say that the only way we got through those trips, was because of God’s protection and guidance. I always find it cool how God can even use a group of “stoner kids” (a group that most of society would deem as unworthy of much of anything) to help him out. I also find it interesting how God chooses to show us how He is in charge of what’s going on. Glad you had a good trip. As I read, I also realized again how I’m glad I’m not in youth ministry any more, although trips were always a highlight.

]]> by: Tyler Watson http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/26/little-moments-of-grace/#comment-90 Mon, 26 Feb 2007 21:01:51 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/26/little-moments-of-grace/#comment-90 Praise God that you all made it safely back. Welcome home. Praise God that you all made it safely back. Welcome home.

]]> by: James http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/04/helping-the-homeless/#comment-89 Thu, 22 Feb 2007 23:06:21 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/02/04/helping-the-homeless/#comment-89 Erika - Thanks for your thoughts. I still feel uncomfortable every time I leave an encounter where someone asks me for money - when I give them money I feel as if I am not giving them what they really need to be released from poverty, and when I do not give money I feel I am being selfish and uncaring. As I sit and think about that, I realize that is perfeclty OK. Is the most important thing finding a way to smooth out my interactions with homeless persons so I can be comfortable? Certainly not. I imagine the feeling of discomfort, or even outrage that this kind of thing is so common in such a wealthy country, is what I need to experience, not "comfort". Erika -
Thanks for your thoughts. I still feel uncomfortable every time I leave an encounter where someone asks me for money - when I give them money I feel as if I am not giving them what they really need to be released from poverty, and when I do not give money I feel I am being selfish and uncaring. As I sit and think about that, I realize that is perfeclty OK. Is the most important thing finding a way to smooth out my interactions with homeless persons so I can be comfortable? Certainly not. I imagine the feeling of discomfort, or even outrage that this kind of thing is so common in such a wealthy country, is what I need to experience, not “comfort”.

]]> by: James http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/01/27/did-jesus-call-us-to-nonviolence-part-1/#comment-88 Thu, 22 Feb 2007 22:54:41 +0000 http://thekingdomnow.blogsome.com/2007/01/27/did-jesus-call-us-to-nonviolence-part-1/#comment-88 Hey Luke - Thanks for taking the time to sift through my cliffs notes. Brimlow spends a lot of time on Bonhoeffer and on the third question you raise. I've written up some notes on that, but I want to publish it in a more bloggish, reader-friendly way. That's in some of the later chapters, so at this pace, look for that around Christmas, 2009. As far as I can remember, he dosen't address the Centurian thing directly, but my best guess is his response would be something like the following: Yes, there are a number of instances where Christ calls people to leave their sin, like with the woman at the well. However, it is problematic to argue that whenever Christ does not call someone to change their ways, that he condones their behavior. For example, just before he dies Jesus has an exchange with the thief on the cross next to him. He acknowledges the man's faith, and does not say anything negative about him. I don't think we can then argue that Jesus condones theft. Hey Luke -
Thanks for taking the time to sift through my cliffs notes. Brimlow spends a lot of time on Bonhoeffer and on the third question you raise. I’ve written up some notes on that, but I want to publish it in a more bloggish, reader-friendly way. That’s in some of the later chapters, so at this pace, look for that around Christmas, 2009.

As far as I can remember, he dosen’t address the Centurian thing directly, but my best guess is his response would be something like the following: Yes, there are a number of instances where Christ calls people to leave their sin, like with the woman at the well. However, it is problematic to argue that whenever Christ does not call someone to change their ways, that he condones their behavior. For example, just before he dies Jesus has an exchange with the thief on the cross next to him. He acknowledges the man’s faith, and does not say anything negative about him. I don’t think we can then argue that Jesus condones theft.

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